Which city would you like to see the NLL expand to?

[Rigfan]

Seeing as its been a few years since the NLL has expanded they should be due for a at least one new team this summer, which city would you put it in, and what other cities would you like to see get NLL franchises?


Vancouver, Montreal, Chicago, Detroit, Columbus, Cleveland, Syracuse, Brooklyn, New York, Boston, Baltimore, Raleigh, or L.A.?

[Wings-4-Life]

Originally Posted by Rigfan

Seeing as its been a few years since the NLL has expanded they should be due for a at least one new team this summer, which city would you put it in, and what other cities would you like to see get NLL franchises?

Vancouver,- Failed already
Montreal,- Failed already
Chicago,- Failed already
Detroit, - Failed already
Columbus,- Failed already
Cleveland,- No interest/ market failed already
Syracuse,- Failed already
Brooklyn,- No interest/ failed already. Twice!
New York,- See above
Boston,- Failed already. Twice!
Baltimore,- Failed already
Raleigh,- Area (Charlotte) failed already
L.A.- Area (Anaheim) failed already

[mtbf]

I would like to see one more franchise go away Washington or Minnesota

go to an 14 game one division format
top four teams advance all playoffs best of two with a 15 minute full time tie breaker after game two if needed. Top seed gets to choose to host first of second game.

balanced schedule

[RockyNY]

Originally Posted by Wings-4-Life

Vancouver,- Failed already
Brooklyn,- No interest/ failed already. Twice!
New York,- See above

Brooklyn NEVER had a team at all. Its different market when you are speaking of Manhattan and Long Island. Think why Islanders are leaving LI for Brooklyn, huh?

And why Nets left NJ for Brooklyn, huh?

And how can Brooklyn failed if this is brand new arena that just opened up on Sept 28, 2012. Geez....


Roy

[laxhawker]

Vancouver is the first place to get a team. Probably 1/3 of the league hails from out here. Don't give me the bullshit about WLA being here and free duckets etc. if that were the case how is it Toronto can sustain an NLL franchise and not us? like I said bullshit. Having a preseason game in Langley isn't a true berometer of how the franchise will or won't do. Langley is a long haul on winter nights for most lax fans. Pacific coliseum would give you a better reflection on this market.

[Wings-4-Life]

Originally Posted by mtbf

I would like to see one more franchise go away Washington or Minnesota

go to an 14 game one division format
top four teams advance all playoffs best of two with a 15 minute full time tie breaker after game two if needed. Top seed gets to choose to host first of second game.

balanced schedule

I'm down with the current 9 team, 16 game schedule. Same thing with the balanced schedule and 4 playoffs teams though. However, I don't like a best of 2. Just make it one and done, and move on.

Originally Posted by laxhawker

Vancouver is the first place to get a team.

This would probably be the next place to get a team (again). I just don't see it happening in the next year or two.

[Hollywood42]

the NY market does not deserve another chance


i would like to see Detroit attempted again

the reason its been so hard to grow the game in new markets is because the game is so pussifiied its almost unwatchable anymore

people go to a game see a 9-8 score with no hitting see goalies wearing a mattress as a chest protector and dont go back

[RockStar#666]

Of the failed markets, my gut says Detroit, Montreal, and Vancouver are the only ones worth a second try.

Of the potential new markets? I really don't give a rat's arse. . Most of the time, with expansion to a non traditional market, they're just throwing **** at a wall and hoping it sticks. Usually it doesn't. The only way a non-traditional market is going to work is if there's a deep-pocketed owner that does several things right from the get-go and strikes gold, like Denver.

So, screw expansion. I'm with MTBF, I'd like to see 8 teams in a single division with a fully balanced schedule.

What I'd love even more, (despite the fact that it will never happen), is if the 14 game regular season was condensed into like 9 to 10 weeks, with most weekends featuring a home game and a road game, and wherever possible a home-and-home.

Dragging a 19 game season over 4.5 months is ridiculous for anything except for NFL football where the freaks-of-nature need the whole week to recover from the beating. Let's get this **** condensed, and over with before MLB starts and before the big leagues have their playoffs get going in earnest!

[Rick716]

Vancouver, for sure would be a nice fit with EDM and Calgary

Boston/New England--always had good support--wish they could get it together there.

Winnipeg--new arena, maybe as a sister to the Winnipeg Jets, not sure how the support would be there.

Montreal--could be a nice fit w/Toronto. Hopefully the exhibition game will lead to something good.

New York-- failed in this area with the Saints/Titans, NJ Storm. Let's give up on NY for a while.

Detroit--would like them to come back at some point.

In the short term, hopefully Vancouver. Whatever happens, I'm hoping the NLL has learned from the failures of the past (there's been enough of them) to only put a team in a stable, secure market. It's better to err on the side of caution and take it slow and not expand unless the situation is right.

I like that they've had franchise stability for a couple years here. I have no idea how Washington is still here with their attendance, but I'm hoping that they can build their crowds some before they are forced to fold.

[RockStar#666]

I'm also with Mike on the best-of-two playoff series, except that I'd suggest that the tiebreaker be two 15 minute periods (each team defends each half), and if it's still not settled, it goes immediately to sudden death and keeps going until there's a goal

I'd also suggest that the top seed gets to pick whether the series opens at home or on the road.

That'd add a bit of intrigue to it.......you'd hate to give up the tie-breaker overtime, but depending on your home record, and the amount of travel involved, maybe you'd hope that your opponent shows up in your barn with road legs so you can hit 'em hard early, and then if they lose, they have to make a miserable trip back to a pressure cooker situation.....and have double the airmiles logged versus your team.

Anyway, whatever. It'll never happen, but it would be a neat way to add series playdowns on a budget.

[Rick716]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

the NY market does not deserve another chance


i would like to see Detroit attempted again

the reason its been so hard to grow the game in new markets is because the game is so pussifiied its almost unwatchable anymore

people go to a game see a 9-8 score with no hitting see goalies wearing a mattress as a chest protector and dont go back

Hollywood, I was there in the MILL days too, and I still find the game to be very physical. The brawling is mostly gone, but I really don't see the game as being weak and unwatchable. I agree that 9-8 is a low scoring game, but let's say the game is 12-10 or 11-10, which a lot of games are. That's a close game with 20 goals scored in 60 minutes...That's a goal every 3 minutes. It seems like a fair bit of scoring to me. If someone is comparing it to a 19-16 shootout, it's low, but I think there's enough scoring.

The league averaged 24.2 goals per game last year. (1744 goals in 72 games)

[Hollywood42]

Originally Posted by Rick716

Hollywood, I was there in the MILL days too, and I still find the game to be very physical. The brawling is mostly gone, but I really don't see the game as being weak and unwatchable. I agree that 9-8 is a low scoring game, but let's say the game is 12-10 or 11-10, which a lot of games are. That's a close game with 20 goals scored in 60 minutes...That's a goal every 3 minutes. It seems like a fair bit of scoring to me. If someone is comparing it to a 19-16 shootout, it's low, but I think there's enough scoring.

The league averaged 24.2 goals per game last year. (1744 goals in 72 games)

you just got way too technical

shrink the pads and bring back the off ball hitting and stop marketing it towards 8 year olds

[RockStar#666]

I dunno how long a MILL-era style would keep me intrigued for. I wasn't there for it, so it's foreign to me.

That said, in the early days of the NLL, in the non-Rock games, there were still lots of 22-19 esque run-and-shoot games. I caught a bunch in Buffalo. I found many were snore fests to me.

It's fun for a while, and you get a few more of the big open-floor hits, but it also gets a bit thin.....almost like a tennis match factor to me....run, shoot, miss, corral loosie, pass up floor, run, shoot......It'd be OK if my home team was good at this and winning all the time, but it's not going to be my favourite style to watch.

I like a hybrid game where they press the ball up floor quickly and greenlight the headman to shoot often enough that the opponent has to respect the transition threat.

That said, I also like to see the top attackers set, make plays together, and get the living **** beat out of them by tough defenders.
In the forty goal trackmeet where rushing defenders took 50 odd shots and scored 20 of the goals, you don't get enough of this.

The other drag is when you have forty goals instead of 25, there's fifteen extra faceoffs, so it takes most of fifteen minutes longer to settle the game. Who needs it? Part of the attraction with this sport to me is it's only a 2.5h commitment even when the game's on TV.

[RockStar#666]

Suggested improvements to increase reward to risk for transition, and toughen the game back up:

-Bring back off-ball cross checking and shrink the net back to it's "proper" width of 4'6".

-Adopt the CLaX bench / change-box rule. This will boost running, but not make it fully take over.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by mtbf

I would like to see one more franchise go away Washington or Minnesota

go to an 14 game one division format
top four teams advance all playoffs best of two with a 15 minute full time tie breaker after game two if needed. Top seed gets to choose to host first of second game.

balanced schedule

Why Minnesota? Why not, say, Rochester? It'd force ex-Khawk fans to support either Buffalo or Toronto or drop-out entirely, but Rochester has a lower 2012 average attendance than Minnesota, I believe. Then again, Rochester had a 15% gain in attendance since 2011.
http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/D...20Ratings&sc=0

2012 NLL REGULAR-SEASON ATTENDANCE

TEAM                   GMS   TOTAL   AVG.  PREV.   %±'11    GMS
Buffalo Bandits         8   127344  15918  17096  -0.069     8
Colorado Mammoth        8   121912  15239  15866   -0.04     8
Toronto Rock            8    89384  11173  10985   0.017     8
Minnesota Swarm         8    68768   8596   8288   0.037     8
Calgary Roughnecks      8    66504   8313  10373  -0.199     8
Philadelphia Wings      8    65696   8212   8609  -0.046     8
Edmonton Rush           8    56312   7039   7152  -0.016     8
Rochester Knighthawks   8    54664   6833   5955   0.147     8
Washington Stealth      8    31224   3903   3819   0.022     8
TOTALS                 72   681808   9469   9819  -0.036    80

Now, KHawk fans, I'm not dumping on the KHawks at all - I'm just pushing the issue hypothetically since I think Minnesota is a fine franchise with a decent and growing fanbase and a very nice arena. Having been there, I'd have considered it an honor to have been a fan of that team.

As mathematically uptight as I am, I'd rather not knock off a franchise - even Washington - for the sake of the mathematics of a schedule or playoff format.

[Rick716]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

you just got way too technical

shrink the pads and bring back the off ball hitting and stop marketing it towards 8 year olds

Hollywood,
I agree with you about the marketing to 8 year olds. The greatest commercial the league ever produced was around 1992. You may remember it. The beginning of "Welcome to the Jungle" with clips of crazy hits and goals as the song builds. Lots of shots of rowdy crowds in the Spectrum. I think it said "MILL Mania". I was 16 and discovering the game. I thought "this is awesome!"

[RockStar#666]

This league has never really looked healthy, but she's limped along for 13 odd years in it's current form and 25 odd in some form.

Couple of teams down sharply, most of the rest flat-ish. Only two made what I'd call significant gains and only one made large gains.

Wondering if we're near a tipping point where we edge from "surviving", to "ailing".

[Mr Boo]

Originally Posted by RockStar#666

Bring back off-ball cross checking and shrink the net back to it's "proper" width of 4'6".

Why change the size of the nets? The nets were increased from 4'6" to 4'9" in 2002, and the average number of goals scored per game has dropped in 8 of the 11 seasons since then. 2011 was the lowest scoring season in NLL history, though it was up 2.5 goals per game in 2012. Is too much scoring really a problem?

[swami24]

Nunavut.

Seriously, less is better, just like i say for the NHL. If the NLL teams are more loaded with talent, maybe they'd get back to the run and gun style that was actually fun to watch, and TV freindly. Standing around waiting for O/D switchs will never draw fans.

[R.I.C.H.]

Of course, I'd like to see the NLL as a ten team league again. That playoff format where 8 out of 9 teams qualify has to go. I'll give New England another chance, not just because I live there, but because it can work. We'll just stay away from (S)TD Garden for a while. (Sorry, I just had to call it that.) I'll even say give NYC another shot.

[sauginres]

Originally Posted by Hollywood42

the NY market does not deserve another chance


i would like to see Detroit attempted again

the reason its been so hard to grow the game in new markets is because the game is so pussifiied its almost unwatchable anymore

people go to a game see a 9-8 score with no hitting see goalies wearing a mattress as a chest protector and dont go back

I'm with you. A border city, like Buffalo.

[mtbf]

Originally Posted by Vin

Why Minnesota? Why not, say, Rochester? It'd force ex-Khawk fans to support either Buffalo or Toronto or drop-out entirely, but Rochester has a lower 2012 average attendance than Minnesota, I believe. Then again, Rochester had a 15% gain in attendance since 2011..

Rochester is a realistic team to relocate but not fold. Ownership is to strong and money is not an issue. The owner bought a hockey team because the lax team was a throw in and he still over paid for the lax team.

Washington Minnesota and Philadelphia seem like the three teams most likely to fold and I would prefer Philadelphia stayed.

[sauginres]

Originally Posted by laxhawker

Vancouver is the first place to get a team. Probably 1/3 of the league hails from out here. Don't give me the bullshit about WLA being here and free duckets etc. if that were the case how is it Toronto can sustain an NLL franchise and not us? like I said bullshit. Having a preseason game in Langley isn't a true berometer of how the franchise will or won't do. Langley is a long haul on winter nights for most lax fans. Pacific coliseum would give you a better reflection on this market.

Pacific coliseum would appear to be the right size, and of course the next Canadian franchise should be Vancouver.

[dtj]

Originally Posted by Vin

Why Minnesota? Why not, say, Rochester? It'd force ex-Khawk fans to support either Buffalo or Toronto or drop-out entirely, but Rochester has a lower 2012 average attendance than Minnesota, I believe. Then again, Rochester had a 15% gain in attendance since 2011.

We all know those attendance stats don't really mean what they should mean. Given recent developments in MN, you can be damn sure that a very high percentage of those butts are in paid seats. Can the same be said for Rochester figures? Like Vin, i'm not dumping on khawks folks, but i'm pretty sure that MN is in better ongoing shape financially.

[sauginres]

Originally Posted by swami24

Nunavut.

Seriously, less is better, just like i say for the NHL. If the NLL teams are more loaded with talent, maybe they'd get back to the run and gun style that was actually fun to watch, and TV freindly. Standing around waiting for O/D switchs will never draw fans.

I take it run and gun means all players play both ways, and the term "transition" becomes obsolete.

If so I'm with you. In my day I've seen many high scoring defensemen.