The Future

Discussion in 'Toronto Rock Forum' started by rocklax#1, Dec 25, 2017.

  1. rocklax#1

    rocklax#1 Member

    With the LeBlanc trade(very happy to see him go) I got thinking of expansion and ways to improve team next year. Granted its been 2 games, but Schreiber has been a ghost of his rookie campaign. What if with the influx of American players, the Rock trade Tommy Boy to whoever gets the first pick in draft, so we can pick Austin Staats? Yes well aware of said team having to agree to this, but its just a thought. I have no idea of Toms feelings of Toronto, but I bet being American he'd prefer to be closer to home playing.

    RockStar likes this.
  2. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    I think I would trade Schreiber and a second rounder for a pick that could become Staats.

    Maybe even throw in McArdle for a draft pick and/or a desired role player that is left unprotected elsewhere....

    two waves of US expansion coming up and four teams.......i cannot see any way these guys make the protected list twice....

    Will revisit this mid season
  3. CrocodileLax

    CrocodileLax Active Member

    I like adding McArdle to the trade. He has less value without Schrieber and a package deal would offset the decline in Schrieber's value if he continues to flatline.

    I'm disappointed that this kind of talk is already floating around and hope Schrieber explodes soon. Although he has looked impotent at times, teams have keyed in on him and coaching staff don't have an answer to free up space for him. He shares some of the blame but not all of it. I'd hate to lose a good player because of bad leadership. That said, others have already noted that it's doubtful Schrieber would stay, with so many American teams shopping for talent.
  4. CrocodileLax

    CrocodileLax Active Member

    My thought though is that management will want nothing to do with Staats. There've been precious few Native players in the full-time lineup and I don't see that changing. Rock management prefers a different style of play than the fast break, high adrenaline approach favoured in Ohsweken.
  5. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    Since the Squires and Tom Montour, I think Trudeau, Henhawk, Vyse, and Attwood...... Of those, Trudeau is the only one that was a regular for a while.
  6. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    Would have been nice to land a Thompson or something, eh?
  7. CrocodileLax

    CrocodileLax Active Member

    I'll never understand the utter aversion to Native players of any stripe. Yes, a Thompson would be nice.
  8. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    I think Trudeau only played in 4 games during his one-year sting with the Rock. I was a little bummed by how his Rock tenure turned out, but he also had the misfortune of being on a team that already had plenty of fire power.
  9. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    You might be right about Trudeau.....I actually could not even remember what year he was here, think it was 06
  10. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    Of course things change, but unless he's done a fantastic job of lying to me it sounds like he's enjoyed his time in Toronto thus far. Of course, as you said, he might prefer playing closer to home and perhaps a trade to Philadelphia in the off-season could manifest itself as it's a much easier commute for him from Long Island to Philadelphia than it is from Long Island to Toronto.

    The idea of Schreiber to Philadelphia (if they have the 1st overall pick) for the 1st overall pick isn't terribly far fetched, since Schreiber would probably give the Wings 3.0 a pretty solid posterboy for their inaugural season.

    Is the whole Rock not historically signing Natives an act of some sort of intentional aversion, or is it just that there never are quality ones available for the Rock to sign when they'd want to sign them?

    In regards to Nick Trudeau, he was with the Rock in 2005 after he sat out the 2004 season for (I believe, but can't 100% recall) personal reasons.
  11. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    as a righty in 2005, he would have to contend with what? Manning, Wilson, Shearer? sometimes Driscoll?, and who else for minutes and touches?

    whoever it was, that was a top 5 for deepest offense ever, so, you cant really second guess it.
  12. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

  13. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    Wilson got like 40 goals that year collecting everyone else's trash.

    i dont think Shearer marked mad points that year, but, he had that cannon of a shot, so, they had to spread the d to challenge him, so, it kind of helped make room for the others

    in another year, a guy like Trudeau might have beat one of them out for more games, but, you dont f with functional perfection.
  14. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    Really, if it wasn't Matt Shearer being that offense's unsung hero and Aaron Wilson benefitting from playing alongside the big three, Trudeau probably would've seen action in at least half of the games that season. I think he was coming off of a 73 point campaign in 2003.
  15. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    I just had a gander at Shearer's stats - 17 goals, 40 points.

    He was brought in to do more than that, but, there is only one ball, and Doyle, Sanderson, or Manning had it most of the time.

    He did bring the threat of the outside snipe, and, I am betting that more than a few of Wilson's goals were from a goaltender losing Shearer's rebounds.......this doesn't show up on the score sheet, but, it is almost as good as the assist that does, and certainly helps a team.
  16. chuckster

    chuckster Well-Known Member

    If Dawick could make a good deal that would get him #1 overall to get Austin Staats (without getting fleeced) and he decided not to simply because Staats is Native, any Rock fan who knows anything about box lacrosse should rip up their Rock fandom card and pick another team to follow. It would be absolutely stupid to pass up drafting Austin Staats just because he's Native.
  17. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    Is this Rock aversion to Natives even much of a thing? Honestly, I don't pay any attention to ethnicity of players in the league, but do other teams have enough Natives on the team that the Rock even stand out for having a lack of them? Or is it just the fact that the Rock are located close enough to the Six Nations that it's a tad puzzling that more haven't seem to have worn a Rock uniform over the years?
  18. fandit

    fandit Well-Known Member

    It does seem that way to me, as a non-Rock fan. I been puzzled for years about it.
    Then again, maybe it's the proximity to all the player in the GTA. It doesn't have to be anti anything, just a case of plenty of good players available closer.
  19. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    I'm thinking it's this. Plus with the amount of natives who have played for the Bandits and Knighthawks over the years, the Rock would seem rather thin in that regard by comparison.
  20. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    Six Nations is pretty well just as close to Toronto as it is to Buffalo. Akwesasne is closer. It aint geography.

    Toronto has, over the years, often run a veteran heavy team that was built by trading draft picks away. The vast majority of the standouts from Six Nations etc. entered the NLL through the draft in the early rounds, so, like, Toronto just wasn't even in the running to get junior graduates.

    without getting the junior graduates, and, with the team being ruled by an Orangeville mindset for all but three years after Bartley had to step back, I guess this was a less natural place for marquee Native free agents to end up, than, say, Buffalo, later Rochester, now Georgia and NE. Even if Toronto were interested in these guys and prepared to pay full freight, the players themselves might not have been as eager to deal with the coaches and GMs here, and, try to build on an already successful career.

    That covers the standout First Nations players.

    For the role players, there is certainly a familiarity bias when it comes to filling the depth part of your roster - Orangeville guy going to use Orangeville guys, Peterborough guy gonna use Peterborough guys, etc.

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