What prevented

Discussion in 'Chicago Shamrox Forum' started by McSwarmFan, Dec 16, 2008.

  1. McSwarmFan

    McSwarmFan New Member

    A Chicago Machine Chicago 'Rox merger?
  2. Meathead25

    Meathead25 New Member

    Sorry, but you really have to ask that?
    The MLL (Body by Jake, Brain by Cement) has been at war with the NLL (admittedly a one sided one, because apparently the NLL just doesn't care enough to respond...lol), even going so far as to say that players in the MLL who played in the World Indoor Lacrosse Championships in 2003 would have their contracts voided, and any MLL players who missed MLL games for OLA, WLA and Mann Cup games would face equivalent suspensions for the number of games missed on their return to the MLL...seeing as the Machine belong to the MLL and the 'Rox to the NLL, two rival organizations with the MLL clearly having a hate on for the NLL, a Machine, 'Rox merger would never happen.
  3. Wingsfan9042

    Wingsfan9042 New Member

    Takes one to know one, Meatface :D
  4. silvanthalas

    silvanthalas Active Member



  5. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    You people are truly obsessed with World Of Warcraft!
  6. StealthDragon

    StealthDragon New Member

    Orcs and dwarves and Death Knights "Oh My".

    I don't think the leagues are that "at war" with each other as Meathead makes it out. The MLL definitely made some horrible decisions in the past trying to limit their players. But there are MLL/NLL teams that work together when they share a town. Doug Locker in San Jose holds high level positions with both teams. Lots of teams share players in the same town.

    I think the limitation in Chicago was that the 'Rox owner also had a vested interest in the new arena they play in. So the Machine would have to pick up the Shamrox and get an arena without necessarily having the same in/discount the current 'Rox owner has. Securing an arena and dates probably wasn't too appealing to the Machine ownership.
  7. Canadan

    Canadan New Member

    Give your head a shake!!!:eek::rolleyes:
  8. barrettaub

    barrettaub New Member

    No, they didn't.
  9. dougm

    dougm Well-Known Member

    i thought that was the case as well re: loughery's interest in the hoffman estates arena. i still say at the looks of it, loughery was only threre to flip the franchise.
  10. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    Yeah, Loughery is part of the ownership group of the Sears Centre, I believe. So, yes, of course he wnts that building to succeed and, to get it to start being used and making money, he bought the Shamrox to have them play there. With the Shamrox not being an immediate success, yet having other clients to use the arena, he wanted to get rid of the Shamrox because they weren't worth it the effort.

    So, I do believe he wanted them to succeed simply because he wanted to make money twice over - once for the team on gear and attendance, et.c., and another because of the building. So, I am sure he would have liked to have had the Shamrox be successful, but he really didn't care for them. Flip This Franchise was definitely on his mind.

    If Loughery has no vested interest in the Sears Centre, then, yes, it was purely Flip This Franchise.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2008
  11. Rox Prez

    Rox Prez New Member

    Neither Kevin Loughery nor any Shamrox owners have had any vested interest in the Sears Centre. It was a rental relationship from the start.
    You will find very few owners in the NLL with as much passion for their team as Kevin but unfortunately a franchise does not run on passion. Loughery would never have "Flipped this Franchise" if given the choice. He loved the game, the players, and everything about his team. He is a true fan of the NLL.
    The facts are that an abundance of early mistakes led to an immediate financial crisis that they tried to dig out of but ultimately could not justify keeping it going.
  12. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    I'd need more convincing than that. I believe that this league has had numerous owners who had considerably less fiscal firepower than Loughery and, despite their losing moeny, they kept with it for years. Look at San Jose. Correct me if I am wrong, but Loughery was looking to sell even before the first season was completed! (I need to check that.)

    Now, I can believe that the economic crisis hurt him this year, but not tremendously so before then, I suspect. If it was all that tough to run the franchise remotely, why not either 1) move it closer to where he operates or 2) why didn't he just start it close to where he operates?

    I don't have any answers and I am sure of nothing. Phil, you may be right. Still, those of us who've been around the block a few times with this league note that the Shamrox ownership was interested in selling that franchise way too early compared to the average of other ownership groups. I'm not being cynical, but Chicago's been a serious outlying data point.

    Then again, what do I know. Charlotte threw in the towel after 1 season while Ontario and Pittsburgh CrosseFire were both moved after 1 season. A few others moved after two seasons...

    Meanwhile, on a side note, I haven't been able to see this video yet because I am precluded from seeing videos on this machine, but I did find an interview with Kevin Loughery Jr.

  13. Rox Prez

    Rox Prez New Member

    Vin, I can now see why those that are involved with teams stop posting on these forums. I posted the truth in simple terms of what happened with the Shamrox. Yet you still want to make it more than it was. I suppose it is more fun and interesting to create alternative motives than to think that it could be as boring as running out of money.
    I sent you a PM with more details to support my post but it basically states the same reasons... just more words.
  14. silvanthalas

    silvanthalas Active Member

    I suggest you speak for yourself and not other people.

    Because, at face value, the excuse of blaming the economy holds no water when the team has been for sale long before the economy went in the tank.

    Pardon us for being skeptical. :rolleyes:
  15. PhillySoldier

    PhillySoldier Active Member

    100% agree

    I doubt highly you can explain any financially difficulities that have suddenly popped up in the last couple of weeks that wasnt there previously.

    The team has been on sale since last year. They did not sell but yet they drafted players, signed broadcasting contracts, booked stadium dates, sold tickets to fans, began training camp and particapated in preseason scimmage(s). They commited to play for the upcoming season without being sold!

    1. So what suddenly changed in the last 2 weeks that wasnt there before?
    2. If the owners new they could not afford to play in this season why didnt they fold over the summer before drafting players and screwing the entire league?
  16. mtbf

    mtbf Well-Known Member

    and since you are no longer employed what is your point?
    So some respect you ahole with out people like Vin there would be no one involved with the league.
    I hope a hobo dressed like santa breaks into your house and craps under the tree
    Merry Christmas
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 25, 2008
  17. FixThis

    FixThis New Member

    Why can't we all just get along!!!!!!!:doh::doh:
  18. Rabid Camel

    Rabid Camel New Member

    Bwaaahah haaah!...does he drink all the wine in the cabinet too?
  19. dougm

    dougm Well-Known Member

    i can believe that economic assumptions made in august were totally turned upside down by november. the car industry was predicting a 13-million units sold production in the summer but afer september it got whacked to 10-million. we may all criticize the rox for what they and did not do, but to say that an unexpected financial turn of events could not be the real cause is totally dismissive than you folks are not reading the same #'s that i am.
  20. silvanthalas

    silvanthalas Active Member

    Well, for me, it's using the economy as an excuse coupled with the timing: pulling the plug with 2 weeks before the season started.

    If the owners were that desperate to get out, they should've just said so, rather than find excuses, because I think it's safe to say the Shamrox would've been folded even if the economy hadn't gone south.

    And the timing just plain pisses me off, and so the Shamrox owners (and their team president, should he decide to defend them and **** all over respectable members of this forum like Vin along the way) deserve whatever is flung their way. :mad:

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