Discussion in 'NLL News and Rumors' started by RockyMaivia, Dec 8, 2017.

  1. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    So, here's the sales chart so far.

    -In just about every section in the joint, you could grab an entire row.

    -All but a handful of the smallest sections have '100+' available.

    -The upper bowl is pretty damned empty except for the front row, and in at least of those sections, you could still buy the entire front row

    -Some of the lower bowl sections - 109, 112, are closer to empty than they are full.

    This said, a lot of the sold seats are $60-70 at walkup, and probably $45 to $55 at season seat price..........

    There is this die-hard core that finds enough value to keep coming (After all, the product has been decent over Dawick's first 8 seasons, and, those tickets would be $200+ for a less fun NHL or NBA experience........).

    Maybe with such a high average sale price, he does come close to breaking even at 8K ish.

    Attached Files:

  2. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    In Toronto next week, I expect the expensive seats and the corners to be half full. Hopefully they can amp up the advertising this week or something otherwise it could be one of the worst attended Rock openers in team history.
  3. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    For some reason, I feel like I've seen that 9,000 is the break even point. But I think that number would be closer to 11,000 because as of an article in 2015 or so I believe Dawick said he's never turned a profit owning the Rock.
  4. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    I can remember reading that an NLL team needed a budget of better than $2.5M per year to operate.

    That was several years ago.

    Mostly through his tenure, Dawick was running veteran teams with higher salaries and bonuses. Also, if he counts some percentage of the equivalent annual worth of the TRAC's capital cost plus its operating costs as direct Rock costs, this probably means he's running on the high end of NLL average......

    The US travel and lodging costs, plus whatever he has to kick into the league in dues, etc., have to be a bit of a killer lately as well.

    The other thing that has been a killer is that for the last three seasons, he's had to host playoff games in every round, and, these are really, really, really tough to sell, even compared with a regular season game. I figure they are also costly, as he may have to option dates at full price early in the season, or risk having to pay ludicrous "emergency" rates later.

    Maybe he needs, I dunno, like $4.5 to 5M CDN to operate, and, that means he needs to book something $450K in tickets and merchandise each regular season game plus another couple hundred $thou per playoff game.

    I don't think there is any way he's doing that without 10K plus in the building, but, I don't know the real numbers.......he's into other things, and, maybe those have taxable profits that he keeps more of because the Rock losses can be used as a credit.

    Whatever. I am thankful he does this as a labour of love, I sincerely hope he gets some kind of a rebate from the expansion fees.
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017
  5. Wings-4-Life

    Wings-4-Life Well-Known Member

    This might be a ticketmaster thing, not a Rock thing. Same thing happened to me when searching for Reading Royals tickets yesterday. My choices were a few in February and March. Had to open the full calendar to get next Saturday.
  6. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    I got a shipload of "rock" concerts first, and, wondered if the Rock had a new re-selling partner........MLSE had made threats of going it on their own a few years ago, probably to squeeze TM into a better deal.

    Would have thought with the full name of the team, that the search algorithm would present the exact match first.
  7. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    This has inspired me to make a "I THOUGHT I WAS GOING TO A ROCK CONCERT" sign to take to a game later this season.
    RockStar likes this.
  8. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    I can't help but wonder if the long-term destiny of the Toronto Rock is to be purchased by the Maple Leafs.
    One or two more NHL franchises as successful NLL owners and that should be sufficient impetus for additional NHL owners that the success of NLL teams that are owned by NHL clubs is not a fluke. And it's not like the Maple Leafs are hard-up for cash...

    I said over a decade ago that the NHL teams should be looking at investing in the NLL as a Plan B for NHL labor strife like the 2004–05 NHL season.

    Meanwhile, on a tangent, too bad the average attendance for this opening weekend was only 6200.5:

    GEO     NBW        5489
    TOR     BUF       11516
    COL     VAN        3201
    CGY     ROC        4596
    Partly to be expected though because NBW and VAN are the smallest arenas in the league. Not sure if ROC's BCA or GEO's arena is the smaller of the two; I think it's ROC. (It is ROC whose BCA = 11215. GEO's Infinite Energy Arena = 11355.)

    3 games on a Friday and starting before Christmas... I like it but it didn't help the gate. I didn't go to the NBW opener because of the distance/traffic/time and I had NLLTV and (I guess this is good news) all the good seats were taken! ---- for the rest of the year!!
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2017
  9. chuckster

    chuckster Well-Known Member

    The NLL booked games in 3 out of 4 of the cities that had the lowest average attendance last year. Buffalo's attendance was off by about 3.5k of last season's average, Rochester was off by about 2,300, NE was up by 87 people and VAN was only down by 5 people.

    I won't read too much into the drop after 1 week that is a month earlier than when they normally would start. Colorado, Sask., Calgary and Toronto which were in the top half of attendance last year still have their home openers to get to.
  10. wacklax

    wacklax Active Member

    When u guys watch the stealth on tv there seems to be no asses in seats . I thought that the standing room areas and the suites were a lot fuller than many other games I have attended there. Friday night is a tough sell in most markets.
  11. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    I'm a little confused by the diagram.
    The little blue dots mean seats are available, right, and greyed-out unavailable for sale?
    For NBW, that's the way the chart is.
    In the chart you provided, the nose bleeds are all grey-out.
    Is that because of the price range you chose?
  12. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    blue means available, grey unavailable.

    they do not even offer the nosebleeds for sale.....have not had to since the last crowd that broke 14.5k or whatever a helluva long time ago.
  13. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    Last time the Rock hit 14,500+ at a game was on March 1, 2008 versus Calgary....

    They only sell the first half of the upper deck. They don't give you the option of buying a seat in the top half, although I have seen people move up there during games.... and engage in some not family friendly activities :eek:
  14. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    That's sad.
    The one time I saw a Rock home game was against Philadelphia I think in 2007. My buddy and I had to sit in the top row of the building.
  15. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    If that was the thrilling 15-14 comeback OT win, then that's the last time the Rock got 16,000 in the building....
  16. Vin

    Vin Well-Known Member

    No, it was 2007, Benesch's ROTY season.

    I was at the 30 MAR 2007 game, a 15-6 drubbing of the Wings, with 16813 in attendance.
    That was the last Toronto win of that season and also was the second highest attended Rock home game that season, with the 15-19 loss to Rochester on 20 JAN 2007 having 16882 in attendance.
  17. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    Man, all these old Toronto attendance factoids are just pissing me off and making me wish I was 5 years older so I could've been around for more of them instead of enjoying them from afar....
  18. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    Trust me, overall, 2007 was not a fun season to watch.......especially since I still had my full price lower bowl seats at this point.

    2008 was OK until the jackasses traded Josh away, and a team that looked like a lock for playoffs lost five straight and missed for the first time in franchise history.

    It was bloody sad to watch Veltman's last game........I swear the Wings actually looked like they were letting up so as not to embarrass a legend at his retirement party.

    2009 was a hysterical faceplant.......Not even Craig "Fücking" Conn himself could make that season fun to watch.

    Dark ages. Let us never speak of them again.
  19. AmericanRockFan

    AmericanRockFan Well-Known Member

    The fact that Craig Conn had a less than stellar run with the Rock is one of my biggest disappointments as a fan. He was a big favorite of mine before he got to the Rock but he was damaged goods by the time he got to Toronto.

    It's too bad he's apparently fallen off the face of the earth since leaving the NLL.
  20. RockStar

    RockStar Well-Known Member

    I think Conn was drafted by Vancouver, but, ended up in Minnesota in the dispersal.

    His first game as a Swarmer in Toronto was funnier than anything an Evans has ever done......he was singlehandedly killing the Rock, until he took himself out for something capital stupid that led to a second major or some such.

    I was delighted to see him come to Toronto in a year that I knew was going to be garbage, because I thought we were going to at least have a big, strong lunatic shirt disturber causing havoc.

    Sadly, he was kinda used up, and too calm for it to be really fun.

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